Troutnut.com Fly Fishing for Trout Home
User Password
or register.
Scientific name search:

> > Maccaffertium spinner, maybe??

Wiflyfisher has attached these 4 pictures to aid in identification. The message is below.
Shown Full Size
Shown Full Size
Shown Full Size
Shown Full Size
WiflyfisherJune 12th, 2008, 8:47 pm
Wisconsin

Posts: 603
Any thoughts as to what this spinner is? My thought is possibly a Siphloplecton specie. I have collected basale before but that has always been early May.

John S.
https://WiFlyFisher.com
GONZOJune 12th, 2008, 9:22 pm
Site Editor
"Bear Swamp," PA

Posts: 1681
John,

I believe Siphloplecton should have staining and anastomosis in the stigmatic region (the area around the leading edge toward the top of the wing). Actually, this looks like it might be a Maccaffertium vicarium spinner. Compare this to some of the male spinners Jason has on the vicarium page and see what you think.
WiflyfisherJune 12th, 2008, 9:32 pm
Wisconsin

Posts: 603
Gonzo,

Thanks for thr reply. Although the timing is right for M. vicarium, the color of these spinners is much darker than any Stenonema vicarium spinner I have ever collected and it's abdomen seems to skinny to me. I agree the Siphloplecton should have staining but I couldn't think of anything else that really resemble these guys.
John S.
https://WiFlyFisher.com
GONZOJune 12th, 2008, 9:50 pm
Site Editor
"Bear Swamp," PA

Posts: 1681
Yeah, it is dark, but consider how the duns vary in color. Check out the 8th and 10th specimens on the vicarium page. They appear to be as dark and skinny as this one (to me).
TaxonJune 12th, 2008, 10:09 pm
Site Editor
Plano, TX

Posts: 1294
Did you notice the darker alternate joinings of the cerci, and that the front of the head appears to be white? The body does seem too dark for that species, but how about:

Scientific name: Maccaffertium modestum

Previously know as: Ecdyonurus ruber, Ecdyonurus rubromaculatus, Epeorus modestus, Heptagenia modesta, Heptagenia rubromaculata, Iron modestus, Stenonema annexum, Stenonema modestum, Stenonema ruber, Stenonema rubromaculatum, Stenonema rubrum, Stenonema varium
Common name: Cream Cahill
Locality: E, M
Nymphal habitat: gravel riffles of medium sized to large streams, where current is swift, but water is shallow (6 inches or less in depth)
Voltinism:
Emergence (begin) date: early-Jun
Emergence (end) date: mid-Aug
Emergence time of day:
Spinner fall time of day:

Nymph (mature) minimum length: 9 mm.
Nymph maximum length: 11 mm.
Nymph identification keys: posterolateral spines on abdominal segment: (7-9); dark posterior margin on sternites: (no); broad femoral flanging
Nymph body description: tergites dark brown, sternites light brownish olive
Nymph legs: light and dark banding w/wide dark femoral bands
Nymph gills: on segments 1-6, truncate, purplish-gray
Nymph tusks:
Nymph tails: 3, w/dark bands

Dun minimum length: 9 mm.
Dun maximum length: 11 mm.
Dun identification keys:
Dun body description: creamy white w/brown markings on tergites; (former S. rubrum): thorax olive, abdomen patterned w/olive
Dun wings: pale gray; (former S. rubrum): creamy-white, faintly tinged w/green
Dun legs: creamy-white, faintly tinged w/green
Dun tails: 2, pale tan

Spinner minimum length: 8 mm.
Spinner maximum length: 13 mm.
Spinner identification keys: head of male translucent white in front, pale reddish brown above, ocelli prominently ringed w/black
Spinner body description: thorax same as abdomen but w/yellow cast, abdomen whitish to cream to orange-yellow to tan; (former S. rubrum): thorax yellowish, abdomen cream
Spinner wings: hyaline w/slight mottling and dark reddish venation; large hind wings; (former S. rubrum): hyaline w/amber longitudinal veins and brown cross-veins, stigmatic area of fore wings slightly tinged w/pink
Spinner legs: hind tarsi 5-segmented; (former S. modestum): tan banded w/brown markings; (former S. rubrum): femora w/narrow midian and apical bands of dilute purple, tibiae smoky at tip, middle and hind legs nearly white w/femora having very faint median and apical ba
Spinner tails: 2, (former S. modestrum): cream to light tan; (former S. rubrum): white to very pale buff, alternate joinings narrowly dark
Roger Rohrbeck
www.FlyfishingEntomology.com
GONZOJune 12th, 2008, 10:47 pm
Site Editor
"Bear Swamp," PA

Posts: 1681
Hi Roger,

Doesn't modestum typically have a mostly white or cream abdomen (with some dark markings on the tergites)?
TaxonJune 13th, 2008
Site Editor
Plano, TX

Posts: 1294
Gonzo-

Yes, that's true. But, does it always? I just don't know. However, I do know that it's the only one in my database with a description of alternate dark joinings, so I thought I'd mention it as a possibility, however remote.
Roger Rohrbeck
www.FlyfishingEntomology.com
WiflyfisherJune 13th, 2008, 5:32 am
Wisconsin

Posts: 603
Gonzo,

I think you nailed it. I didn't see the second Maccaffertium photo page before. Jason took his photos of the Maccaffertium vicarium spinners on a river in the same area as I got these last night. For some reason I remember Stenonema vicarium spinners as lighter and more color than these. At least I had on the right fly. :)

There was a mixture of E. invaria and M. vicarium above the run last night. Quite a sight to see. Everything is late up here this year and the water is really high.

BTW, I changed the thread title so people searching won't get the wrong results.

Thanks!
John S.
https://WiFlyFisher.com
GONZOJune 13th, 2008, 10:07 am
Site Editor
"Bear Swamp," PA

Posts: 1681
Lovely water in that last photo, John. With all the rain and flooding in the Midwest, I bet you're counting your blessings that your streams are only "really high." Could be worse, huh?

If your spinners are fairly large (~12-16mm), they probably are vicarium. They can be lighter--just that variability thing. The Maccaffertium nymphs in the new photo might be other species, perhaps the one Roger detailed above. Just guessing, but are they smaller (~9-12mm)?
WiflyfisherJune 13th, 2008, 2:14 pm
Wisconsin

Posts: 603
The NW corner has not had all the rain that Central and Southern Wisconsin has had. The rivers are all high but in really good condition.

The smaller nymph might be Maccaffertium modestum. The larger reddish nymph I assumed was vicarium.

Thanks again Gonzo and Roger.
John S.
https://WiFlyFisher.com

Quick Reply

You have to be logged in to post on the forum. It's this easy:
Username:          Email:

Password:    Confirm Password:

I am at least 13 years old and agree to the rules.

Related Discussions

TitleRepliesLast Reply
Re: Not sure what this is...
In the Photography Board by Freepow
3Jun 6, 2008
by Freepow
Re: Size Variation in March Browns
In the Identify This! Board by Fishskicano
5May 20, 2009
by GONZO
Re: Insect photos on CatskillFlies website
In the Mayfly Genus Ephemerella by Jpsully
4May 24, 2008
by Softhackle
Re: 2 tails or 3
In the Mayfly Species Maccaffertium vicarium by Snagy
1Feb 6, 2010
by Taxon
Re: Finally my "Stenonema" section isn't empty
In Stenonema femoratum Mayfly Nymph by Troutnut
2May 20, 2007
by Troutnut
Re: 2 tail
In the Identify This! Board by Sandfly
4Nov 12, 2011
by Sayfu
Re: PINE CREEK PA.
In General Discussion by Jonsecrist
8Jan 24, 2011
by SlateDrake9
Re: Maccaffertium name change
In General Discussion by Brookyman
8Jan 1, 2013
by Brookyman
Re: Maccaffertium vicarium / rivulicolum
(4 more)

In the Identify This! Board by Brookyman
2May 9, 2013
by Brookyman
Re: Maccaffertium vicarium / rivulicolum
(1 more)

In the Identify This! Board by Brookyman
4Feb 21, 2013
by Brookyman
Most Recent Posts
Re: Changing fly line
In Gear Talk by Red_green_h
Re: 6wt reel help
In Gear Talk by Swampfox (Partsman replied)
Re: Cold weather fly fishing
In Beginner Help by Red_green_h
Re: Boots
In Gear Talk by Martinlf (Wbranch replied)
Re: nm
In Gear Talk by Red_green_h
Re: My (new) place and its environs
In the Photography Board by Jmd123 (Partsman replied)
Re: Holy Waters - over-rated
In General Discussion by Brian314 (Partsman replied)
Re: Site updates from September 11, 2019
In Site Updates by Troutnut (Martinlf replied)
Re: Fly fishing Basque Country in Spain
In General Discussion by 87Defender (Wbranch replied)