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Mcjames	July 5th, 2007, 7:11 am
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139
	I am haunted by waters
Martinlf	July 5th, 2007, 10:26 am
Moderator Palmyra PA Posts: 3233	Nice pics, and I thought you needed that open loop to set the fly down more delicately. ;>
	"He spread them a yard and a half. 'And every one that got away is this big.'" --Fred Chappell
Mcjames	July 5th, 2007, 10:37 am
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139	yeah, thats it... I meant to do that!
	I am haunted by waters
GONZO	July 5th, 2007, 12:09 pm
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	James, Don't apologize about that loop. Good trout-fishing casts are seldom the photogenic things that you see in magazines. I can throw tight loops and a lot of line when I want to, but I've seldom found either of those skills to be all that practical for close-in trouting. Sure, a tight loop is great for punching through the wind on big Western streams or for rocketing long lines in the salt or on lakes. But they're often disastrous for nymphing with weight, and there's seldom an advantage to throwing any more line than is absolutely necessary. Before I consider throwing a long line, I always look to see if there's a way I can get closer. PS--The Neversink is a classic, and stunningly beautiful.
Mcjames	July 5th, 2007, 12:29 pm
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139	thanks for the encouragement Gonzo. I was never taught to cast, just got out there and started throwing it. So its not always pretty. And I have to be very careful with the weighted nymphs-- I (still) fish with a fiberglass rod (scandalous!) and have a tough time even lifting big nymphs out of the water with it (have my eye on a 9' Winston 4wt but not enough pennies in the piggy bank yet). what a beautiful river-- we hiked down just 2 miles max into the gorge, and only saw one other fisherman.
	I am haunted by waters
GONZO	July 5th, 2007, 12:58 pm
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	Hey, there's nothing wrong with fiberglass, either. I've been building my own rods forever, mostly for the same "piggy bank" issues you mention. I use graphite now, but most are 1st or 2nd generation blanks that are pretty soft by today's biffo-stiffo standards. I don't like the stiff blanks for some of the same reasons I mentioned above. Heck, many of the super stiff rods won't even load decently at normal trout-fishing distances. You can improve their close-in performance by throwing a heavier line weight, but who wants to spend a lot of money on a high-tech 4-weight if you need to throw a 5- or even a 6-weight in order to get it to work properly at close range? (The traditional Winstons have a very smooth action, so that shouldn't be a problem with your "dream" rod.) Have you tried using a roll pick-up to help lift the heavy nymph with your fiberglass rod? Sometimes you can even use several rolls to help bring the nymph higher in the water column, but that works best when the cast has drifted well below the fish in order to avoid spooking.
Mcjames	July 5th, 2007, 1:12 pm
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139	I usually strip/mend as the fly drifts toward me, and then feed the mended loops back out as I let the fly drift all the way down until all my line is straight downstream. Once it is, the fly rises to the surface, and I sling it back up. When you say "roll", is that lifting the rod tip to raise the fly/ collect line before casting?
	I am haunted by waters
GONZO	July 5th, 2007, 1:24 pm
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	A roll pick-up is performed just like a roll cast, except that as the fly comes up, a normal backcast and forward cast are used to direct and deliver the fly. If one roll is not sufficient to bring the fly/weight to the surface, a second roll immediately following the first will usually do the trick. Unfortunately, roll casting is one of the casts that can't be practiced properly on a lawn (you need water tension), so give it a try the next time you're on the water. PS--The technique you mention is a form of "water hauling," and is a good solution as well. The advantage of the roll pick-up is that you can often get the fly back in action without letting the line run all the way out, and redirection is often easier because you have both the backcast and forward cast to accomplish the direction change. Trying to significantly redirect a water haul sometimes puts the fly/weight dangerously close to your ears!
Mcjames	July 6th, 2007, 6:03 am
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139	I will give it a try-- thanks.
	I am haunted by waters
Shawnny3	July 6th, 2007, 8:30 am
Moderator Pleasant Gap, PA Posts: 1197	I agree, Gonzo - sometimes great casts don't have to look that great. I've been developing a few casts and presentations over the past few years for close-quarters fishing, and they're not very pretty, though they can be technical in their own ways. There are a lot of ways to get flies to fish, and that's part of what makes each fisherman unique. My older brother is an unorthodox fisherman who has also developed some very effective presentation techniques that work far better for him than they ever do for me, try as I might to mimic exactly what he's doing. Again, part of what makes us unique. And one of the reasons he ALWAYS seems to catch more fish than I do. -Shawn
	Jewelry-Quality Artistic Salmon Flies, by Shawn Davis www.davisflydesigns.com
BxRxTxK	July 6th, 2007, 5:14 pm
western NC Posts: 29	awesome pictures..(man what a stream!!)thanks for sharing...
Flyfisher06	July 7th, 2007, 6:40 pm
argyle ny near saratoga Posts: 48	nice pics mcjames how was the fishing I am planning on being down there someplace on saturday Ihope if you are not busy that day maybe we can meet up and scare some trout icaught a nice brown today on my Battenkill it was between 16 and 17 I guess it liked the look of my hopper and i liked the look of him
	IF I am not flyfishing or bird hunting I must be doing something bad like working !!

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