Toughest Trout Water, Page 2

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GONZO	July 3rd, 2007, 8:45 am
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	James, I've heard many reports of frustration with the "cream caddis" hatch on Pine. But, I've never heard or read (Meck mentions them) any information about the genus/species that is responsible for all this angler angst. Any ideas? If not, can you add anything about size, emergence habits, or anything else that might help to identify the culprits? (Blizzardlike flights of caddisflies are usually mating swarms, and rarely create many feeding opportunities. However, the emergers or egg-layers are often a different story, and identifying the critters may help to solve the problem.)

Mcjames	July 3rd, 2007, 9:02 am
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139	sadly my knowledge of entomology is so weak as to be almost nonexistent (although I am addressing that deficiency via this wonderful website). To the best of my recollection, the bugs were about a size 14/16 and distinctly lighter colored than the tan caddis I've often encountered there. It would have probably have been around mid/late May.
	I am haunted by waters

GONZO	July 3rd, 2007, 9:15 am
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	Thanks, James. You couldn't have picked a better place to gain some entomological insight. Your information does help to rule out a few possibilities. Does anyone else have any information about Pine's infamous "cream caddis"?

Wbranch	July 22nd, 2007, 6:25 am
York & Starlight PA Posts: 2733	The toughest water I ever fished was Benhart's Spring Creek on the Milesnick Ranch in Belgrade, MT. Moderate size spring creek by MT standards; narrower than the Livingston springs and wider than Poindexter Slough. The fish were very shy and one often had but one attempt at a fish. Other times you would have to stand completely still for long periods of time for the trout to begin to rise again and then if you kept your false casts to a minimum, and away from the target, you had a good chance of being able to start hooking up.
	Catskill fly fisher for fifty-five years.

Davez	July 23rd, 2007, 9:13 am
Pennsylvania Posts: 59	Rleep, oh my god, i know EXACTLY the creek you speak of. Interestingly enough, My friend is the vet that takes care of one of the farm owners cattle...he allows us to fish there. We night fish it. and those fish CAN be caught. or fish it after a rain. its one of those marginal streams that have sections of gold. back to the convo.... the toughest place ive fished? thats a tricky one. I can;t make judgments on having fished a river once or twice. but thre are some waters I consider "home waters" that have tough fish. its all what you are after- the delaware can be tricky. fish that see a zillion flies and have seen it all. but if you chuck a streamer through there, you will consistently land big fish. falling springs can be a bear at times, but then again, i don;t fish it at those times. the toughest place for me right now is my farm pond. i just bought a farm that has about a 2 acre pond on it, and the bass are TOUGH to catch- well, the big ones are. the darn little ones outrun the big ones to your flies! dave

GONZO	July 23rd, 2007, 10:18 am
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	Dave, you might try my infamous "selective hooking" tactic: fish a fly so big that the little guys can't get it into their mouths! Admittedly this is a bit harder with...well...largemouths. (Just don't try this around Louis, or you'll never hear the end of it!) ;)

Martinlf	July 23rd, 2007, 2:07 pm
Moderator Palmyra PA Posts: 3233	Still trying to convince us that you missed all those fish on purpose, eh Gonzo? Tsk, tsk.
	"He spread them a yard and a half. 'And every one that got away is this big.'" --Fred Chappell

GONZO	July 23rd, 2007, 5:53 pm
Site Editor "Bear Swamp," PA Posts: 1681	See what I mean? :)

Davez	July 27th, 2007, 7:54 am
Pennsylvania Posts: 59	gonzo, i use that tactic alot when brookie fishing. fish a monster sized humpy so the little guys dont get hurt. bass are another story. I whacked a largie last night that was a total 5 inches, on a 7 inch fly! that would make a 12 incher, right?

JOHNW	July 27th, 2007, 4:49 pm
Chambersburg, PA Posts: 452	I'll throw my hat in on this one. I find Falling Spring to be a routine stream for me but should qualify that I live practically on this stream so it should be routine. The Delaware system falls in the tough range because of sheer size, the Letort is on the List for the exact opposite reason and both qualify as reality check streams when I start thinking I'm pretty good at this sport. JW
	"old habits are hard to kill once you have gray in your beard" -Old Red Barn

Dreedee	July 28th, 2008, 11:54 pm
Posts: 16	I find the fishing in the spring creeks near River Falls to be moderately easy, though, as in any river, the bigger ones are terribly illusive. I find the Brule and the Namekagon in northern WI to be quite tough. Access is the problem with the Brule; you need a canoe to get to the good water. You mostly pick up small brookies on standard patterns. The larger fish are caught on streamers that look like frightwigs. Mouse patterns at night often bring up the monster browns. But the night fishing is not my bag. Lake runs browns and steelhead get in there, too. But I'm not a steelheader, and haven't made the trip for the fall run. The Namekagon is a beautiful river with some very large browns. But you can have a blizzard hatch and see not one fish rising. You catch 10 chubs to every trout, and the trout are usually small. But then you'll hook an 18-incher while prospecting with a large caddis. Schweibert wrote a good story called "Night Comes to the Namekagon," which described the river accurately. Once, I fished the river for two days and caught one trout. But it was a 20-incher. The river is too kinky to ever become a true "destination" river. But that's part of why I like it, and can even mention it without worry of mobs of anglers.

Falsifly	July 29th, 2008, 9:55 am
Hayward, WI. Posts: 661	Bill, Unfortunately I have not read Ernest's “Night Comes to the Namekagon” but the word night is of key significance. I have been fishing the Namekagon for about fifteen years and at one time owned a home on the bank. During that time I fished the river almost on a daily basis. Aside from the early and late part of the season, being on the water before dusk was a waste of time (if there is such a thing while fishing). Day time revealed many chubs and the occasional very small Brown as you state. I found that I had to be on the water daily to be successful, the river and fish are very finicky about revealing secrets. I have seen the blizzard hatches with nary a rise and I have seen the water come alive with feeding trout. We all know that the chance of success is directly proportional to time spent on the water, but the Namekagon takes this to a higher level. If I missed more than a couple of days in a row it was like starting all over again. We have all heard the experts expound on the Brown’s nocturnal habit and the Namekagon Brown is the quintessential nocturnal. I have not witnessed mobs of anglers but I have witnessed mobs of tubers kayakers and canoeists. I don’t know if this contributes to the Brown’s nocturnal habits but it certainly contributed to mine. Many of us know the challenge that night fishing presents and in order to succeed on the Namekagon it is more often than not a requirement.
	Falsifly When asked what I just caught that monster on I showed him. He put on his magnifiers and said, "I can't believe they can see that."

Mcjames	July 29th, 2008, 9:59 am
Cortland Manor, NY Posts: 139	the lower stretch of the Harlem River in the Bronx... I have yet to raise a trout from its murky depths, and its hatches remain indecipherable to me
	I am haunted by waters

Shawnny3	July 29th, 2008, 6:59 pm
Moderator Pleasant Gap, PA Posts: 1197	Try the East River. I hear it's teeming with wild brookies. -Shawn
	Jewelry-Quality Artistic Salmon Flies, by Shawn Davis www.davisflydesigns.com

Trtklr	August 14th, 2008, 2:02 pm
Banned Michigan Posts: 115	I just fished Tippy Dam on the 12th of this week, I vote for this area. I would bet a few of you have heard of it, and some may have fished it, for those of you who don't know this is the end of migration for steelhead and salmon on the manistee river. I call it fish mecca, because there are always fish there. A gorgeous place where tiny creeks form right out of the hillside. You can fish the dam and catch a wide variety of coldwater and warmwater fish. The hard part of course is catching, these fish see fisherman every day pretty much. My friend and I had a great day there last year during a caddis hatch but that was my only time I did well. Report for Tippy: water is down maybe 6-8" from average. Clear as usual. No signs of migratory fish(give it 2-3 weeks). My friend caught a few brown on crawlers. I missed 3 on dries.
	I have seen nothing more beautiful than the sunrise on a cold stream.

Troutnut	August 15th, 2008, 12:02 am
Administrator Bellevue, WA Posts: 2737	I just noticed these spot-on comments about the Namekagon, and I'm glad someone brought it up in this thread. It certainly deserves the position. Dreedee wrote: The river is too kinky to ever become a true "destination" river. But that's part of why I like it, and can even mention it without worry of mobs of anglers. And Falsifly wrote: Aside from the early and late part of the season, being on the water before dusk was a waste of time (if there is such a thing while fishing). Day time revealed many chubs and the occasional very small Brown as you state. I found that I had to be on the water daily to be successful, the river and fish are very finicky about revealing secrets. I have seen the blizzard hatches with nary a rise and I have seen the water come alive with feeding trout. We all know that the chance of success is directly proportional to time spent on the water, but the Namekagon takes this to a higher level. If I missed more than a couple of days in a row it was like starting all over again. We have all heard the experts expound on the Brown’s nocturnal habit and the Namekagon Brown is the quintessential nocturnal. Both great descriptions. When it's "on," it's one of the best trout streams in America. The rest of the time you'd hardly know it's a trout stream except that it looks like one. And it takes a lot of luck with your timing and location to catch the Namekagon when it's really hot, unless you're out there learning it almost every day. The layers of mystery beneath the Namekagon run deeper than in any other river I've fished. Falsifly, where on the river did you own a house?
	Jason Neuswanger, Ph.D. Troutnut and salmonid ecologist

Falsifly	August 16th, 2008, 8:45 am
Hayward, WI. Posts: 661	Jason, I lived off Namekagon Lane across from the airport not too far upstream from Lake Hayward. The water in front of the house I wouldn’t consider trout water but a short walk upstream and I was into them. The stretch from the KOA campground down to the Airport Road Bridge was always interesting because you could hook into smallies and muskies. A 17 in. smallmouth and a 26 in. muskie are my largest while trout fishing. Much to my chagrin they weren’t taken on dries. As I am sure you are aware the water upstream from the HWY 63 Bridge is the best, with its liberal sprinkling of hot spots if the timing is right. I don’t know how many times I sat on a rock just before dusk waiting for the magic to happen and left in total darkness never seeing a fish. But there were enough times when the water came alive with feeding trout to bring me back again and again. I remember one evening in the Seeley area. It was after dark and the fish were going crazy, I had the rod tucked under my right arm and the leader in my left hand with the fly dangling at my feet. My head lamp was on and I could see the fly on the water damn near between my legs when a 15 inch Brown came up and took. I swear I was literally walking on trout. Anyway, I see your Dad on occasion and understand that your brother was up not too long ago. I trust they had some good fishing. Next time you make it home give me a call, I’d like to meet you and hear about Alaska. Maybe we could walk on some Namekagon Trout.
	Falsifly When asked what I just caught that monster on I showed him. He put on his magnifiers and said, "I can't believe they can see that."

Briankeen	August 19th, 2008, 5:42 pm
altoona pa Posts: 2	Letort ! Carlisle War college............
	Keep the high ground ! William Darby

Wiflyfisher	August 21st, 2008, 4:37 pm
Wisconsin Posts: 663	Well, I added one more species to my Namekagon fishy collection this summer... a dang crappie... good size one too! And it was above Seeley a ways. It is definitely the "on" days for those of us who frequent it often that keeps us coming back, but I could do without the crappies and northerns.
	John S. https://WiFlyFisher.com

Ericd	September 28th, 2008, 9:13 pm
Mpls, MN Posts: 113	This year was the first year, in about ten, that I've missed out fishing the Namekagon. My wife and I usually canoe/camp the river once a year. I have to be honest and admit that I've only targeted the smallie population of this fine water. I can't wait to try it at night next year, thanks to you fellows. Has anyone caught a trout in this area on the St. Croix?

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